EP340- Rhonda Fleming Hayes Discusses Her New Book Garden For life : Practical Ways To Keep A Big Garden Enjoyable

A big garden can be a gift, right up to the day it starts to feel like a second job. We’re joined by American garden writer Rhonda Fleming Hayes to talk about her book *Gardening for Life* and the practical reality behind a question many of us avoid: how do you keep gardening as you age without letting the work take over the joy?

We dig into strategies that make a garden more manageable without stripping away what you love. Rhonda shares a simple but powerful idea for accessible garden design: create zones, bring the most intensively planted beds closer to the house, and let the far edges shift towards lower-maintenance planting, native plants, and even rewilding. We also chat about raised beds, elevated planters, and vertical gardening, especially for anyone thinking about “right sizing” to a smaller space while still wanting fresh herbs, salads, and colour.

Safety gets a proper spotlight too, because a fall can change everything. We talk through common trip hazards, why it’s worth reviewing paths and patios, and how to rethink pride around getting help, whether that’s hedge cutting, ladders, or tree work. Along the way we touch on smarter, more ergonomic tools that reduce strain and keep you gardening longer.

If you’ve got a big lawn, long hedges, or a garden you want to enjoy for decades, this one is for you. Subscribe for more, share it with a gardener in your life, and leave a review to help others find the show.

Transcript

Welcome And Why Ageing Matters

SPEAKER_03 0:13

How's it going everybody and welcome to episode 340 of Master My Garden Podcast? Now this week's episode is an interesting one and we're going stateside again. And I'm delighted to be joined by Rhonda Fleming Hayes. And she has a new book out called Gardening, Garden for Life. And it really caught my eye because the subject of the book is strategies for easier gardening and more joyful gardening as we age. And I think that's something that is going to be relevant for a lot of people. Whether it's the listeners of the podcast or maybe parents of the listeners, it's, you know, and especially here in Ireland, we've big gardens and you know, we tend to have a lot of hedges, a lot of pruning. And then as we get older, are we going to be able, number one, or will we have the desire to continue to do these jobs? So Rhonda's book is brilliant at kind of talking about those things, maybe coming up with little strategies that we can use to make our gardens more enjoyable as we get older. And uh yeah, there's loads, loads. It's a big book, 220 or 40 pages, a lot of pages anyway, and a lot of great, great content in it. So, Rhonda, you're very, very welcome to Master My Garden Podcast.

SPEAKER_01 1:22

Well, thank you for having me.

SPEAKER_03 1:24

Yeah, so the the what initially caught my eye was the the subject line of the book, as we said. Um, so strategies for easier greening, greener, more joyful gardening as we age. And uh here in Ireland we have a situation where most people have, especially in the in the rural areas, which a lot of the population lives in, um big gardens. So typically we're talking one acre, uh, maybe two acres, and a lot of hedge and quite a bit of pruning. And yeah, your book is very, very good. You talk about the realities of aging, which a lot of us probably won't ever want to admit to when when the time comes. Um you talk about the benefits of gardening from a health perspective as well, and lots of practical tips, and you have lots of gardener spotlights and so on. So tell us about the book, tell us about the origins of the book, the the thought process behind it, and then we'll start chatting through the various strategies that you that you mentioned.

SPEAKER_01 2:23

Oh, okay. Well, um I'm in a I'm a garden writer in America, and uh during my uh time as a garden writer, you know, I meet so many uh gardeners with these inspiring gardens. And you know, these gardeners tend to be in their the ones with really fantastic gardens seem to be in their 60s or 70s and their 80s. And what I notice about them is that they are uh, you know, they're curious, they're grounded, they're active, they're uh, you know, and they're open to using their gardens and enjoying their gardens in different ways as they age. But at this, and you know, it's like a lot of them, it seems like they found the fountain of youth, but that's a garden. But at the same time, I'm hearing all these rumblings from my gardening friends, my garden writing friends on the social media. So many people are thinking of downsizing, you know, they're they've built this big, beautiful garden, and then suddenly one day it becomes too much. Yeah, and then uh people have expressed that they they felt guilty or they felt overwhelmed and they were just sad at the thought of letting it go. And so I thought, man, there needs to be a book that addresses the challenges and the joys of gardening as we grow older.

SPEAKER_03 3:47

And yeah, because there is like there's certainly, and I think as you said in your book, the you know, as we get older now, people are healthier, more mobile, uh, stronger than maybe in the past. Um, where so when you retire, when you're working, excuse me, when you're working in your um commuting to work, you're bringing when you get home, you're bringing kids to matches, you're bringing kids to dancing, you're on the go all the time.

SPEAKER_00 4:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 4:19

And in those early days of your garden, the garden can at times feel like a chore. But I guess then when you retire from work, the garden can be some become something very, very enjoyable and something to keep you active and something to give you a bit of a per a purpose. Uh and then as we transition further on in life, it can get,

When A Loved Garden Feels Too Much

SPEAKER_03 4:40

as you said, a little bit too big, too daunting, uh, too difficult to maintain. And then the thought process comes, can we downsize or is there ways of is there ways of maybe gardening smarter as we get older, I guess.

SPEAKER_01 4:55

Yeah. Um, you know, we're looking for that sweet spot where you still are reaping the benefits of gardening, you know, the joyful parts, but then you don't want it to become a chore. And there there comes a time when some of those tasks, like pruning hedges, things like that, just becomes too much. And so you don't want to give it up entirely, but you want to aim for the middle somewhere where you know it's still keeping you moving and you're still enjoying it. And uh, you know, I don't know what the number is there in Ireland, but here um the number of people that want to age in place. Do you use that term over there?

SPEAKER_03 5:36

No, but I guess it means stay in your in your home. Stay in your home.

SPEAKER_01 5:39

So we call it aging in place. Yeah. Well, they also want to garden in place. Yeah. And so that number is 77% of people over 65 would like to stay in their homes.

SPEAKER_02 5:50

Right.

SPEAKER_01 5:50

And so that that's a big number. And um just, you know, there are lots of people over here we have that that have suburban gardens. They're different than your rural gardens. I actually lived in England for a couple of years, so I can picture what your rural gardens look like. Um, but a lot of people here have big suburban gardens with big lawns, things like that, that they, you know, are, you know, they they can't decide if they want to leave it. They don't know if they should move to a townhouse or a condo. And and if they get in that situation, will that little tiny area, you know, satisfy their their need to garden? So it's a lot of people are in a real conundrum. And um, you know, you can fix a house for aging in place, you know, you can put in grab bars and make sure the rugs don't slip and things like that. But you know, the garden is always moving and growing, and so that's a whole different animal there. And so um, I try to include, you know, everybody's got a different garden situation. So I try to include some some strategies that are kind of a leaping off point for people to think about either reducing this actual size of the the cultivated areas of their gardening or kind of reducing the scope of their gardening while staying in place. And then I also address well, if maybe there are some there's enough reasons that you should want to move and you know, go to a smaller gardening situation.

SPEAKER_03 7:22

Yeah. Um 77% is a big number of that's a big number, yeah. That's a big number.

SPEAKER_01 7:26

And it's and it's pretty a reliable number. It's the AARP, which is the association of something retired people over here, which is considered a pretty good source for numbers on senior citizens.

SPEAKER_03 7:38

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I I would imagine, because I don't know that I haven't heard that term being used here, and I certainly haven't heard any surveys on it. But just anecdotally, I would think that we're, you know, most people are in that situation where I would think our percentage is at least similar, if not maybe a bit higher. And for various reasons, uh, we have a lot of bigger gardens here. Um so your book, your book talks about obviously the realities, it talks about the benefits, but you also get quite practical in the book. So maybe talk about some of the practicalities. And I'm guessing, you know, there is some things that have happened over the last number of years, the the likes of robot lawnmowers which have helped. Um, but you you uh you know, uh, like my garden here, when I built the house, I had to have two acres. An acre of it is where the house is and gardens. And essentially, there's a lot of lawn which I've reduced with a wildflower meadow. I'd like to reduce it further, uh, and I definitely would like to get a robot in time so I don't have to go out and mow because I actually don't enjoy that part of it.

SPEAKER_01 8:46

But I I'm curious about the robot mowers because my husband's an engineer and he has our whole house automated. Everything is you know, you you talk to somebody and things happen. You know, but I'm like, that's funny. He, you know, he's finally relented to the electric mower, but has he thought about the robot one? Maybe it just doesn't fit our small lawn or something, but I'm surprised he hasn't brought that up yet.

SPEAKER_03 9:11

Yeah, so over here they've gone very, very popular because for that reason we've had we do have a lot of big lawns, and yeah, uh we've a lot of people who are still working commuting um and whatnot, and the time for mowing grass is quite small, and also we get a lot of rain. I know when we before we recorded, I told you we were in the middle of a heat wave, but we get a lot of rain. So if your only time for cutting a lawn is on a Saturday, for example, and every second Saturday in Ireland it rains, uh you can you can see the problem. Yeah, yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_00 9:44

So that's why you wrote Is that where the sheep come in?

SPEAKER_03 9:47

Yeah, I suppose it's it's it's a it's an option for some people, I'm sure. So yeah, but your book mentions very, very practical solutions.

SPEAKER_01 9:55

So let's talk about some of the some of the solutions uh that well, um, you know, obviously allowing that everybody's garden is different. Um, I talked uh about one strategy being that you break your garden in the a larger garden into zones according to uh the intensity of cultivation and how much maintenance it needs, and to bring try to bring all of your really intensely

Zoning A Garden To Cut Effort

SPEAKER_01 10:20

cultivated areas, your flower beds, your perennial beds, all that, you know, the showier part of your garden to bring it closer to the house, uh, to save you lots of trips, to maybe reduce it in scale, but also so that you can look at, you know, when you're stuck in the house in the rain, you can look out the window and appreciate your efforts. And then as you go further out, um you kind of breaking it into zones that need fewer and fewer uh uh interventions as you go out. Uh and maybe at the at the edges of your garden, you're gonna let it go wild. I think you guys call it rewilding over there, right?

SPEAKER_03 10:58

Yeah, yeah. I actually didn't spot that as I flicked through, but you do mention that in the book as well, do you?

SPEAKER_01 11:03

Yeah, because I'm on an urban lot. My uh we live, uh I have lived on acre lots before, but this one is uh a quarter of an acre, and we're in a very wooded city, but at the back of my property, um, I don't really have a conventional American backyard. I just have an area that's very uh just kind of does its own thing back there. There's a lot of native plants. The only person that goes back there is the dog to sniff around and look for rabbits. And so I don't even really bother back there. You know, I tend to concentrate everything up close to the house or out front where um it gets uh, you know, it gets um, I don't want to say fans or observers, but where, you know, there's that public-facing interaction with the garden. So that's where I tend to keep the most intensely uh planted areas. And then there are other strategies, it's about, you know, materials and methods and tools. Um, I try to bring everything up now. I go up. So I'm using, you know, my kitchen garden is all raised beds. Um, I'm experimenting with elevated planters, um, vertical planters, different things like that, that where I'm not having to bend over and stoop as much. I'm still getting plenty of of exercise and enjoyment, but I I'm not crawling around on the ground as much now.

SPEAKER_03 12:23

Yeah, yeah, that's that's good. Uh vertical gardening is something that like it's generally a lot more popular in in your part of the world. Uh it doesn't seem to do that well here, but as you get older, vertical gardening, you know, having a vertical planter, I know you guys are you have aqu aquaponics and different things where you have towers with all your with all your salads in it. Yeah. Um, like that's a brilliant, brilliant system, but for some reason it doesn't take off here. But if you can have your herbs and your salads, you know, at workable height, um, it really makes life a lot easier. And you can have your fresh, your fresh produce right close to the house.

SPEAKER_01 13:06

Yeah, and I think that there's, you know, there's so many products coming out. And some of the first prototypes of some of these vertical planters, they're quite expensive. But I feel like as they grow more popular, they're becoming, you know, they're they're coming down in price. Uh, I'm experimenting with one out. I've got it just kind of in a corner of my kitchen garden where I'm growing strawberries, and that's fun, you know. But what I said in the book was that I kind of tried to pretend what if I only had a patio or I was, you know, a much older person and I just had a balcony. How could I continue to garden? So these these elevated planters and these vertical gardens, you know, sometimes it's a wall garden or a shelf type situation. Um, it's surprising how much you can grow in one of those. You can get 30 plants in this vertical little tower that I'm growing, and it's probably an 18-inch diameter footprint. Yeah. So you could actually do a couple of those. And I'm doing strawberries, but you could just as well do salads or flowers or something like that. Yeah. And it's so easy to take care of it. You know, you're not you're not bending down at all. And the rabbits don't get it. I don't know how the rabbits do in your country, but they are they're my my prime nymphs.

SPEAKER_03 14:23

They they're they're they're a problem in certain certain areas. Around here, they're not. We've had a big resurgence of foxes in this area. So we okay, good for you. We have very little rabbits now, but it's the balance has nearly gone too much towards the foxes now. So and they don't have predators here.

SPEAKER_00 14:38

It's always something, isn't it?

SPEAKER_03 14:39

Yeah, it's always something, yeah. Um, just in terms of your of your own raised or your vertical planter, is that hydroponic or are you in in soil?

SPEAKER_01 14:49

It's in soil, but the top um of it has kind of a bowl shape with a spout. And so you water it from the top. And so when I'm out there watering the rest of my raised beds, I just you know put the the hose up there and um run the hose for a minute until it all trickles back down. It's about five, six feet tall and um waters pretty quickly. You know, we've had a lot of rain so far this season, more than I think usual. So I haven't really had to to do anything with it. Um, but yeah, something like that um uh I think deserves experimenting with. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 15:26

Yeah, for sure. Um so you you've mentioned some practical things there, reducing the size, maybe breaking up into little zones and and having the workable zones and the showy zones smaller and closer to the house, which makes sense. You also mentioned materials, changing of materials or uh updating materials. What what are you are you thinking there? I know you you mentioned things about footpaths and you know how you would make them non-slip and various things.

SPEAKER_01 15:54

Yeah, I think that it's really important. Um, this is this goes back to when you're trying to decide, am I going to try to age in place or do we think we need to downsize, which I like to in the book call right size. That's not as it doesn't sound as negative. But um to I I urge people to go and give your garden a good look through, uh, evaluate it for safety because as we get older, and I am noticing this more and more, um, our balance gets a it's not as great anymore. You know, we've got creaky knees, and so we're we're

Raised Beds And Vertical Growing

SPEAKER_01 16:30

unsteady when we're going down steps or when we're, you know, when we're stepping through paths. So uh I urge people to go through and really look to see that their paths and their patios, any kind of hard surface is in good shape so that you don't have any little buckled ridges or uneven places, um, wobbly stones or something like that that's gonna throw you off or trip you when you're, you know, I go out in my garden and I'm not paying attention sometimes to my feet. I'm looking at my beautiful plants. It's easy to get dazzled and then boom, you know, you trip. And now when we get to our age, I turn 70 next week. Um, you know, a fall can have really life-changing repercussions. You can lose a garden as a gardening season, or you can end up, you know, in bush shape. So those little things. So I encourage people to go around and really study their hardscape for safety and just ease of accessibility so that they can get out in their garden. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 17:31

Yeah. And and you you mentioned another couple of things that were were good. Um where where and when to look for help. And I guess, you know, if I'm relating it back to the Irish situation, we have the, as I said, these big hedges. And, you know, in terms of meterage, quite a lot of meterage, generally speaking, they're quite high. So there's a lot of work in that, but it makes sense at a certain point to offload that work to a professional to get it done much quicker. Okay, it'll cost you whatever it's going to cost you, but you won't be under pressure doing it, and then you can focus on maybe more enjoyable jobs. Is that kind of the thinking? I know you you mentioned arborists and various people that can come in and help you at various stages.

SPEAKER_01 18:15

It's a matter of safety, but it's also a matter of kind of prioritizing your energy. If you've only got so much energy, and you know, as you're getting older, um, repetitive injury comes in if you're doing, you know, something, uh, some type of movement over and over, like pruning that hedge. And so we talk about, you know, when is it time to hire help? And there's that psychological part. And this is this goes right in with, you know, the aging aspect of the book, which I dealt with also. You know, there's a lot of us, the neighbors and I here, we all we're all kind of avid gardeners and we all kind of tease each other about, oh, I see you got so-and-so helping you today, you know, and one of the other neighbors is like, oh, you have help, you know, it's like, well, yeah. At some point, um, I have one uh shout out to Kurt who helps prune for me. You know, he gets up there on the ladder where I can't anymore. But um, you know, getting help is is not cheating. I used to think it was, and I don't feel bad about it anymore. But, you know, the more you can offload the the really hard, unsafe or not unsafe, but unsafe for you type practices, the more you can, you know, you can play with containers and you know, grow vegetables and things like that, and not, you know, not have to worry about those things because at some point it goes from being just a task to being a dreaded task.

SPEAKER_03 19:44

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, and I guess that's the thing. When as I mentioned at the start, when you're when you're at the stage where you're working and driving and commuting and dropping kids and mining kids.

SPEAKER_01 19:55

It's another time to get hell.

SPEAKER_03 19:56

Yeah, it's a chore, it's a chore at that stage.

SPEAKER_01 19:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 19:59

Then at a certain point it becomes, you know, it becomes a a nice chore, or it becomes something that's you know nice to do and keeps you mobile and all those things. And then it reverses again to being a dreaded chore, as you said later on.

SPEAKER_01 20:14

So if you can out you I think you're right about that, it kind of comes and goes there, doesn't it?

SPEAKER_03 20:19

Yeah, yeah, for sure. Uh certainly here, I I know I'm referencing it a bit, but those hedges here are are uh people you know people really dread those at at the at various stages, but they're useful then at other stages too.

SPEAKER_01 20:30

Oh, I love the hedges. I remember walking along the hedges and seeing all the the berries and the flowers and the birds. They're I I wish we had them here.

SPEAKER_03 20:38

Yeah, for sure. You you mentioned tools as well in the book. So what have you found any kind of unusual tools, editing that's I know I go to some garden shows, but you know, in Germany particularly, and it there would be a lot of manufacturers from the US and China and various places. And I always find that the US the US manufacturers are very, very clever with their tools. Um I'm talking about things like uh wheelbarrows with handles that twist so you don't actually have to lift through your through your arms and your back. Uh the handles twist with it. I've seen them with uh spades, digging spades, with uh for want of a better word, an extra handle that allows you to dig without bending down and leverage, yeah. Yeah, leverage on it, yeah. So and it always seems to be the US companies that are a little bit ahead of the curve on this, but over here we never see those tools. They don't seem to sell.

SPEAKER_01 21:36

So tell us about some of the people should because you're you're the gardeners.

SPEAKER_03 21:39

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, they should definitely, because they're such clever little devices, but they've never they've never really taken off here.

SPEAKER_01 21:47

So tell us about some of the ones that you found to be Well, I talk about in the book how you know sometimes after you reach a certain age, you kind of have these favorite tools and you kind of you know stick with them. I've got The same diber I've been using for 20 years. I've got my my Felco pruners I've been using for 20 years. And this is me telling myself this as much as my readers, go out and look what's out there now, what's new, because there's all there are all these new tools that maybe you should think about, you know, instead of your old standbys that you tote around in the bucket all the time. Um, I think that I like people to to consider using long handled tools whenever possible, instead of kneeling down and like I said, crawling around in the dirt to weed. Um, you know, I think with a tiny diamond point hoe, I can get in there and do the same thing. Uh, you know, it's nothing unusual, but it's the long handle. I think a lot of weeding uh, you know, could be we can, you know, if we keep on top of it, we can just scrape weeds versus having to get down there and pull those re those roots out every time. Uh, then when it comes to trowels, if you are working down lower or if you're planting um, you know, containers or a lot of trows now are ergonomic in the fact that they have uh a curved handle that that puts your hand in a neutral position instead of um that lever type action that we've done before. Uh a lot of them have thumb rests and different little, just little,

Safer Paths And A Fall-Proof Garden

SPEAKER_01 23:20

they've tweaked it just enough that it makes it so much easier to use. So looking for tools like that that fit your body because everybody's got a different shape hand, um, you know, and they're tall, they're short, they're whatever. And the the length and uh style of the handle can really change just that little bit, can change uh something from being uh a motion that can cause injury to something that really makes gardening easier.

SPEAKER_03 23:47

Yeah, and and there's loads of you have to mention a good few little tools there, like the the travel with the extra little handle on it, um give you more leverage on various things. And I I I would I'd hope that they start to come over this way, but so far people don't adopt them over here. Uh you mentioned Felco there.

SPEAKER_01 24:04

Well, you need to start a movement.

SPEAKER_03 24:06

You need to start a movement. But there's a there's a brilliant tool in the Felco range with a revolving handle. Um so I don't know what number Felco you use, but I think I have the six because I have big hands.

SPEAKER_01 24:19

I might have some Dutch ancestry. I'm a big boned girl.

SPEAKER_03 24:24

Yeah. But the there's one there's one with a revolving handle. So if you're doing repetitive pruning, if you have a lot of rose bushes or a lot of fruit trees or whatever the case would be, and you're constantly uh squeezing the the secretaires, the the blade or not the blade, the the handle rotates in your hand. So it completely takes out that. Um and it's it it it really is, you know. Now it's only if you're doing a lot of pruning that you would notice the difference, but if you had a lot of fruit trees or a lot of rose bushes, to have it rotating in your hand as you're pruning, it really takes the strain out of it. It's it's an unbelievable how a little small tweak can make such a big difference.

SPEAKER_01 25:03

No, that's really valuable because you know you can go out with your pruners and like your loppers or whatever and go snip three or four branches, and you're like, oh, that's no big deal. But once you're on the you know, the 400th one, yeah, yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_03 25:18

Um another feature in the book is the gardener spotlight, and there's various gardeners across, I'm I'm assuming different types of gardens, um, different situations. Is there any that stand out? Is there any that are doing you know kind of anything different than what you're talking about, or anything unusual within these gardener spotlights?

SPEAKER_01 25:39

Well, uh a lot of them we have gone through the downsizing process. And in fact, one of them has done it twice. And so that was really good to have that real authentic um advice from them about you know what problems they ran into, things like that. So I think uh just from that standpoint, those are worth reading those spotlights. Um, one of the people, uh a fellow Master Gardener, do you guys have Master Gardener programs over there?

SPEAKER_03 26:09

No, but there is there is talk of getting one. We have just had our first horticulture apprenticeship set up here. So Master Gardeners.

SPEAKER_01 26:16

It's the same idea, kind of.

SPEAKER_03 26:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:18

So one of those is one of my fellow uh master gardeners, Larry Sapola. He's um he's just uh a whirlwind of energy and he's into his 80s now. And I think it's it's funny to, or if not funny, but interesting to see how people's gardening lives evolve. And when I first met him, oh, 15, 16 years ago, he had this beautiful suburban garden with I think he had seven decorative ponds. He had a Japanese tea house, he had all these things, and it was just and he had this massive vegetable gardening because he's Italian and he likes or Sicilian and he likes to cook. And then the when I went to photograph him now, um, he is really involved in hydroponic gardening now. And so his entire back area was just filled with hydroponic experiments, you know, and in the end, it's all about him teaching other people. And he wants to teach people that don't have access to property how to grow their own food. So I thought that, you know, that's that really merits a second look. You know, that's not about downsizing, that's maybe about the changes that happen as you grow older, and maybe your your style of gardening changes or your goals change.

SPEAKER_02 27:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 27:34

And then I tried to uh have people from different parts of the country because we obviously have all different kinds of geography, climate, topography. And so I tried to get somebody from California, Arizona, but then the one from Arizona, she went and moved to Florida right after that. So I've gone from watching her grow cactus now, watching her grow tropicals. So that's that's interesting. Uh, who else was in there? Uh people from Ohio, um, uh quite a few here from Minnesota that all have a different, you know, take on their gardening. So yeah, it was it was fun, but I thought it helps to hear from somebody other than just me.

SPEAKER_03 28:13

Yeah, yeah, you get you get different, as you say, different types of gardens, different situations, and everybody's situation will be you know, will be different, you know.

SPEAKER_01 28:22

Yeah, and and I garden, I I've lived in Minnesota now for 17 years, which is longer than I've lived, well, other than growing up in California, but my husband's job had us moving all over the country and England. And so uh I've gardened in all these different climates, and

Hiring Help Without The Guilt

SPEAKER_01 28:40

so that's kind of informed my gardening experience. And now we spend half the year in uh down south in New Orleans avoiding the winter here, and so that's a whole new gardening experience. So, you know, gardening uh it's so different in different places, just completely different um joys and problems, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 29:00

Yeah, for sure. You mentioned uh photography. So are you a garden photographer as well?

SPEAKER_01 29:04

Or is it general photography or what's I uh uh the way I say say it is I'm not a professional photographer, but I'm a good photographer. I take most of my pictures for my my books and my stories. So mostly gardening.

SPEAKER_03 29:20

Yeah, very good. You had a previous book, uh Pollinator Friendly Garden. Um is that still published?

SPEAKER_01 29:27

Is it yeah, it's a different publisher, but it's still available on on Amazon and in uh a few bookstores still, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 29:33

Yeah, and I guess that is as the name suggests, so it's uh pollinating you know plants that are suitable for pollinators and and so on. And you mentioned in your in your space out the back, you have a lot of native plants um in the wilder area. So is that was that just let to go rewild, or did you actually plant native plants in there?

SPEAKER_01 29:56

Well, it it's funny, my entire garden. Um because we built this house and I was able for the first time to actually plan a garden instead of adapting to all these other people's gardens. Um, you know, I I kind of had priorities. I'm gonna have uh a certain thing out front, I'm gonna have my kitchen garden, I'm gonna just let it go wild in the back and have a little pond. Those are my my my things. But um in the back, I planted native plants, but then native plants also showed up.

SPEAKER_03 30:30

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 30:30

So I planted a service berry, I planted a red, you know, a red bud tree, I planted dogwood bushes, those are all natives, but then all of a sudden, Virginia water leaf shows up and it's this low-growing um spring blooming plant that has these beautiful lavender blooms and kind of um leaves kind of green with little white splotches, and it just kind of filled in and became a ground cover. And it was like, oh, okay, that's good. Yeah. And then out front, um, the milkweed that is so valuable for monarch butterflies here, um, you have other butterfly migrations. Uh, it also just kind of showed up. And I just instead of going, oh, you know, it's it's a problem, uh, it's real the the common milkweed is uh it's not it's not a beautiful plant. It's a little coarse looking, but when it shows up out front, um I edit it. I just pull the ones I don't like, I leave the ones that look, you know, that are placed right because nature sometimes knows how to do that. And so um each year it reseeds, and then I start the process over. And there's lots of other plants that show up that I'm like, well, where did that come from? Where did the violets show up from? Oh, they must have come from the woods down the street.

SPEAKER_03 31:49

Yeah.

Tools That Protect Hands And Backs

SPEAKER_01 31:50

And it's kind of fun.

SPEAKER_03 31:52

Yeah, yeah, for sure. And and you're you're mixing and matching, and as you say, editing a little bit.

SPEAKER_02 31:57

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 31:58

Yeah. Um, in relation to your wild area out the back, so I know here because I've seen it with certain people, um, as they get older and the garden becomes more difficult, and maybe an area gets away from you or gets a bit untidy, which as you said, the front of your house is kind of in keeping with everyone else. Um to a certain way.

SPEAKER_01 32:21

Well, not everyone else. You can tell it's my garden.

SPEAKER_03 32:25

So it has its own style.

SPEAKER_01 32:27

You can see what I'm interested in.

SPEAKER_03 32:29

Yeah. So but but it does have uh a certain look that is.

SPEAKER_01 32:33

Yeah, there's a certain look and a certain flow there, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 32:36

Yeah. And uh but wilder areas are they're becoming more acceptable. But how how was that? Because I know that as I say, certain people when they get older, they're they allow certain areas or maybe not intentionally, certain areas get away from them and they're not able to keep them tidy, and it becomes a source of frustration to you. Um, but in your garden, it sounds like you have all these native plants. I'm sure there's huge biodiversity, I'm sure there's huge nature building up in there. So, how do you look at that area now? Does it uh are you looking at it differently, or was that the intention when you decided to let this go?

SPEAKER_01 33:14

Well, it was my intention to not have a um uh it was my husband's intention to have a bigger garage so that the backyard wasn't as big. But it was my intention for what was there to not have to be taken care of, really, for it to just kind of be out there. And yeah, I do, we do have to go out there and and you know, weed occasionally. Like right now, there's a there's a native plant called jewel weed that is growing back there, which is uh a good pollinator plant, but it tends to be a little too happy back there. And so once again, I and it's really easy to pull out. I don't even have to bend over. It gets pretty tall and I just pull those stems out. Uh sometimes I leave a section of it because it's not totally unattractive. So yeah, it's not that I don't manage it a little bit, but for the most part, it it's not something I worry about. And because it's not, you know, we're in a situation where we're, you know, up next to people's fences, I'm not gonna worry about it. It's not exposed to anybody. Something like, you know, I'm not worried about, oh, what are the neighbors gonna think? But, you know, there are more and more gardens in my neighborhood that are incorporated, and they're not just that, you know, what you see maybe in the movies, that flat lawn with two bushes that you see in American housing tracks. Um, more and more people are planting what I call a plant-rich landscape in their front yards, and there are lots of efforts to plant for pollinators. So my yard is not as unusual as it used to be 10 years ago. Okay, but there are still plenty of you know tidy lawns.

SPEAKER_03 34:52

Yeah, yeah. Um as we start to sort of round off, um, if you were to give people sort of two or three takeaways that they could look at now to as they're aging in their gardens, or if somebody's listening and maybe a parent or you know, a friend is aging in their garden and it is becoming hard. What what kind of two or three takeaways would you uh number one is buy the book, but uh thank you.

SPEAKER_00 35:21

I appreciate that. Buy that book.

SPEAKER_03 35:24

Buy that book, um but just a couple of kind of practical practical kind of guides.

SPEAKER_01 35:30

Well, I think the most important thing is I tell people don't stop, don't stop gardening. You know, I hear people say, oh, we're gonna move to a condo and we won't ever have to

Gardener Stories And Changing Priorities

SPEAKER_01 35:40

do yard work again. And I think, well, there's a difference between tending a garden and yard work, and please at least have a pot of flowers on your front step or something, because I think um that connection with nature as you grow older is so important. So I would say stay involved in some type of gardening. And uh also maybe uh, you know, we can't stop time, but we can change our expectations, maybe accept a few imperfections and and not be so so worried about what the neighbors are going to think or worried about how does that look, you know. Once you get to a certain age, I say plant what you like and just enjoy what you what you grow, you know, don't worry about what people think.

SPEAKER_03 36:27

Yeah, yeah, and definitely and a garden can give purpose as well.

SPEAKER_01 36:30

Um that's very important. Purpose, reason to get up.

SPEAKER_03 36:34

Yeah, a reason to get up, reason to do something, and yeah, have a bit of pride in it and all the other benefits of of gardening you mention in your book as well. So um where can people find the book? So it's um garden for garden for life, strategies for easier, greener, more joyful gardening as we age. A brilliant, brilliant uh subject. So where where can people find the book?

SPEAKER_01 36:54

I'm hoping that it's gonna be in lots of your local bookstores.

SPEAKER_03 36:58

It's on Amazon dot called K or dot ie as well.

SPEAKER_01 37:03

Okay, and hopefully dot what's the one for Ireland?

SPEAKER_03 37:06

ie is Ireland, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 37:08

Okay. Hopefully there too. Um it has uh that's there's been a couple interviews where uh that got picked up in the independent, and I think there's one coming up in the telegraph, so it should be cut becoming better known over there, uh which is it which really pleases me because um I you know I have a a soft spot for gardening over there. Um and that time I spent, it wasn't in Ireland, but it was very life-changing. Those those green hedges. Oh wow, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 37:40

Yeah, and and it's also a book that I think will be useful because we uh as I say the the subject and the name of the book caught my eye because it is something that I've noticed here uh that there's there's a need for something like this, you know, to I suppose show people that there's ways that there's it doesn't have to be a chore that you can still enjoy your garden and should still enjoy your garden while Yeah, I think um you know the book, you know, obviously uh it's it's an American book, but the principles are the same for gardening anywhere.

SPEAKER_01 38:12

So I think that you know, there may be a couple plant lists that might not jive with people over there, but um, for the most part, any of those those ideas and strategies can be picked up on gardeners anywhere.

SPEAKER_03 38:24

Yeah, for sure, for sure. Uh final question before I close off. You mentioned you have a big birthday next week. Uh I think uh I have I have a big one myself in a couple of weeks.

SPEAKER_00 38:34

So what number?

SPEAKER_03 38:36

Uh 5-0.

SPEAKER_00 38:38

Oh, the big 5-0. Yeah. Oh, to have the to be 50 and young again.

SPEAKER_03 38:44

So uh well, you you sound young, so have you any plans for the big birthday?

SPEAKER_01 38:49

Uh,

Stay Connected To Nature

SPEAKER_01 38:50

you know, my birthday is July 3rd, which always comes on the July 4th celebration.

SPEAKER_03 38:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 38:57

So um it c my birthday kind of gets swallowed up in all those fireworks and picnics and everything.

SPEAKER_03 39:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 39:04

My daughter, who lives in New Orleans, comes up to visit me that week, and that's always the highlight of my birthday.

SPEAKER_03 39:09

Well, hope you enjoy it anyway, and uh hope you have a great weekend.

SPEAKER_01 39:13

It's always, as you say, you have a good 50 too.

SPEAKER_03 39:15

Thank you. Thank you. Um, so yeah, it's a really interesting, really interesting book and I think a really useful book. Um I hope so.

SPEAKER_02 39:24

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 39:24

I'll put the link to link to I'll find it on Amazon.ie or.com, whichever one it's on, and I'll I'll put a link to it in the show notes anyway. Um, but it's been a really interesting chat. The book sounds brilliant, it sounds like a practical thing that people do need. Uh so Rhonda, thank you very, very much for coming on Master My Garden Podcast.

SPEAKER_01 39:44

Well, thank you. You made it so easy and fun.

SPEAKER_03 39:47

So that's been this week's episode. Huge thanks to Rhonda for coming on. Uh yeah, I I mentioned at the start, this I think is a really important subject to to talk about for us Irish gardeners, particularly. We do have a lot of big gardens, we do have a lot of gardens that and I think here people do want to stay in their homes. So the you know, the options of reducing the size of the gardens uh really make

Where To Find The Book

SPEAKER_03 40:10

sense. So I think it's gonna you know it's going to be relevant for a lot of people. So if you do have a gardener in your life, or if you are that gardener who who's listening and you are thinking of, you know, this garden is needs to be a little bit more manageable as I as I as I grow older, then yeah, get yourself a copy of that book. It sounds brilliant. Uh and that's been this week's episode. Thanks for listening, and until the next time, happy gardening.